Jeff Roundy, Author at Latter-day Saints Q & A

August 28, 2019 By Jeff Roundy Leave a Comment

Metal Plates Discovered – Evidences

This video discusses the many discoveries over the last century of ancient engraved metal plates, some in stone boxes and some bound with rings, which reverse all of the scoffing from critics in the 1800’s of Joseph Smith’s story of receiving the Book of Mormon record on ancient engraved metal plates and is another evidence of the restoration.

Okay, so on this Evidences video I want to talk a little bit about ancient metal plates. Let’s start with a quote from Latter Day Saint scholar, Paul Cheesmen. He said, “At the time of Joseph Smith’s remarkable discovery of the golden plates, it is evident that a knowledge of any ancient culture writing on metal anywhere in the world was not public knowledge.”

Then Tad Callister, in his book that he just released, a Case for the Book of Mormon, said the following. “Even if there was limited knowledge before 1830 of some metal plates used for record keeping, it was obvious that the critics of Joseph’s day did not know about or believe it. Otherwise, they would never have promoted the argument that the golden plates were a myth. For example, Martin Thomas Lamb, a Protestant minister wrote, ‘no such records were ever engraved upon golden plates or any other plates in the early ages.'”

Hugh Nibley wrote, “It is often too easy to forget that nothing in the coming forth of the Book of Mormon excited louder howls of derision than the fantastic idea of a sacred history being written on gold plates and then buried in the ground.” Callister continues, “To now argue that Joseph Smith, on a rural farm located on the then existing frontiers of America, knew of some limited findings of ancient metal plates and used that knowledge as the basis for his story of the golden plates, while his many critics were completely unaware of such findings, seems most unlikely. At Joseph’s time, the belief that ancient civilizations did not keep records on metal plates was almost universally held.”

I’ll get us into a couple more details on that in a minute, but first let me show you some of these plates that have been found. This is some really fascinating things here. So if you look at this first one here, this was the plates. King Darius of Persia, dated to 515 B.C. These were found in 1933 by a German archaeologist in a sealed stone box, if that sounds familiar to you there.

Then let’s go to another one here. This is ancient golden plates found in modern-day Bulgaria, in the 1950s. These were dated at 600 B.C. I really liked these because they showed an example of a bound by metal plates with the metal rings, which again sounds familiar.

Here on the next screen, gold plates of Pyrgi, modern-day Italy, town of Santa Severa, found in 1964, and these were dated to 500 B.C. If you look at here, this was actually a find in the Dead Sea Scrolls. A copper scroll found in Qumran by an archaeologist in 1952. It’s a Hebrew text been inscribed on two rolls of copper and dates to between 50 and 100 A.D.

Now I wanted to read a quote here from the LDS scholar, Jeff Lindsay on this topic of there were a couple people that have written, this is what Tad Callister is referring to, a few spots now they can find that people have mentioned this ancient writing on metal plates by Jahn and by Von Humboldt.

So here Jeff Lindsay addresses as he says, “There also were people who had written about some of the ancients writing on metal, but this knowledge had by some scholars was not widely known by any means, and is very unlikely to have been known by Joseph Smith or his associates. There is no evidence, for example, that Joseph Smith had access to Jahn’s book, which does not appear to have been available in the nearby Manchester Library. Do we have any critics…”.

Now think about this. “Do we have any critics in the 1830s pointing to von Humboldt or Jahn as sources that Joseph must have used to add plausibility to props in his story. Do we find them noting that ancient writing of scripture on metal plates per se, was a plausible notion Smith had derived from earlier sources? No, we find them guffawing at every turn. From what I’ve seen, among the many reactions of early critics to the story of gold plates, we find shock, dismay, outrage, sarcasm, righteous indignation, scorn, mocking and related rejections.”

“What I have not seen is the least acknowledgement of plausibility in the external physical trappings of the Book of Mormon story. For example, we do not find learned critics admitting that ancient peoples in the New World could have written sacred texts on metal plates and buried their record in stone boxes as Joseph described, particularly if they had ties to the Old World where such practices were well known. We do not find critics dismissing Joseph’s story as an obvious build on established knowledge about ancient writing on metal plates. What critics failed to recognize is that neither I nor Nibley are arguing that nobody knew about ancient writing on metal.”

“Neither do we argue that Joseph Smith could not possibly have known that writing on metal was known in the ancient world. We argue that this was not common knowledge and that these basic concepts were rejected and ridiculed along with everything about the Book of Mormon, a book that has become less ridiculous with time. Remember Stevens biographer wrote that ‘Steven’s work in 1839 caused an entire reorientation in the minds of Americans who viewed the native inhabitants of the continent as mere savages.'”

I’m going to give you four quick examples of critics who, in 1857, the critic John Hyde, Jr., in Mormonism, it’s Leaders and Designs, wrote, “We must remember that it is a Hebrew youth who has lived at Jerusalem all his days until he leaves for the wilderness. The writing material then in use, and it was only very few who could use them, would be those such a youth would be familiar with. Now, the Jews did not use plates of brass at that time. Their writing materials were 1. tablet smeared with wax, 2. linen rubbed with a kind of gum, 3. tanned leather and vellum, 4. parchment, or 5. papyrus. All the writings of the Jews, long anterior and subsequent to Zedekiah, were in rolls. These rolls were chiefly parchment and papyrus.”

“The use of this material superseded the stones filled with lead. Hesiod’s leaden table, Solomon’s wooden planks, the wax tables, so clumsily and easily erased. This material rolled up could be bound with flax and sealed. The Jews used this material. The Egyptians, whose language Nephi gives his father, used this material. Contradiction and inconsistency are stamped on any other assertion. This is another strong proof of imposture.”

Then if you look here, the learned Reverend M.T. Lamb in 1887, in his book, comes to this forceful conclusion. “But after a very careful study of the book, a conscientious and painstaking examination of all the evidence gathered both for and against it, the author of these pages has been forced to reject every one of the claims. He is compelled to believe that no such people as are described in the Book of Mormon ever lived upon this continent. That no such records were ever engraved upon golden plates or any other plates in the early ages.”

Now, two more. LaRoy Sunderland, in his pamphlet, 1838, “The Book of Mormon purports to have been originally engraved on brass plates. How could brass be written on? This book speaks of the Jewish scriptures having been kept by Jews on plates of brass 600 years before Christ. The Jews never kept any of their records on plates of brass.”

Last one here from 1920. Stuart Martin said, “It does not seem to have been pointed out to the youth Joseph Smith that gold will corrode if left in the earth for the number of years those plates were supposed to have been buried.”

Now to show you the number of plates that have been found in the old world. If you glance at the screen here, two pages worth of all of the different places. You’ll see there in Asia. This is the old world, Europe, Egypt, more Egypt, Mesopotamia, Palestine, Turkey, 62 different finds there at this point.

Then as far as the New World, here. So in the John Lloyd Stephens, in the Incidents of Travel in Central America, in 1839, he published this. His biographer gave us an important insight into the impact of Stephen’s work. He said, “The acceptance of an Indian civilization demanded, to an American living in 1839 when the first edition of Stephens appeared in England, an entire reorientation, for to him, an Indian was one of those barbaric tepee dwellers against whom wars were constantly waged, nor did one ever think of calling the other Mesoamerican indigenous inhabitants of the continents civilized. In the universally accepted opinion of the day, they were like their North American counterparts, savages.”

So John Sorenson, Emeritus Professor of Anthropology at BYU, he talked about finding metal plate writings here in the New World. He says, “The position of orthodox archaeologists for many years had been that metals were not used in Mesoamerica before about 900 A.D. Nonetheless, the years passed and the earth continued to yield its treasured truths. One basic lesson we learned from the experience is that the experts were quite wrong. Metals were indeed in use in Book of Mormon times and Mesoamerica. What kind of evidence is there? The most compelling consists of actual specimens found when an early date is positively indicated. Over a dozen of these significantly precede 900 A.D. The earliest piece so far notably dates back to around the first century B.C. It’s a bit of copper sheeting found on top of an altar in the valley of Mexico. Several ancient American languages had a word for metal. Work in comparative linguistics shows that metals must have been known and presumably used at least as early as 1500 B.C., which dates back to the time of the Jaredites.”

So in conclusion, these are the last two quotes I wanted to share. Tad Callister. In this conclusion in his book he says, “The critics insistance that metal plates were not used to record ancient histories only magnifies the improbability that Joseph could have known of their existence. Therefore, his reference to metal plates as a medium for ancient writings is all the more astounding, nothing short of divine disclosure.” And then Hugh Nibley in 1952, “It will not be long before men forget that in Joseph’s day, the prophet was mocked and derided for his description of the plates more than anything else.”

So I hope you enjoyed this video. I think it’s a great example of being patient. Many of these evidences will come forth with time. It’s fascinating of all the criticisms that were had on this specific topic early on, they now look rather silly when you see all the findings, particularly over the last century that have come about. I hope you enjoyed the video. Subscribe for more.

Resources:

Books:

A Case for the Book of Mormon by Tad Callister

Of Faith & Reason by Michael Ash

Websites:

https://www.lds.org/study/ensign/1979…

https://www.deseretnews.com/article/7…

http://www.shields-research.org/Scrip…

https://ldsmag.com/the-gold-plates-of…

https://www.jefflindsay.com/bme25.shtml https://www.fairmormon.org/answers/Bo…

https://knowhy.bookofmormoncentral.or…

Latter-day Saints’ Q&A is a video series not produced by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, but by me, an ordinary member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, an independent voice, with a passion for studying Church history and defending the faith. In this series, I provide evidences for the restoration, and address tough questions posed by critics of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, offering faithful answers based on accurate research and historical references which will be posted at the end of each video.

August 28, 2019 By Jeff Roundy Leave a Comment

Understanding One True Church

In a recent survey, one of the greatest stumbling blocks for those who left the Church was its claim to be the one true church. This video shares statements from the Church and its leaders to clarify what is meant and not meant by this claim, as well as discusses the many valid truths held by people of different faiths around the world. Also reviewed is how God has interacted with ALL his children throughout history.

Hey. On this video, I want to talk about one true church. What led me to think about doing this video was actually reading this book, The Next Mormons that just came out by the journalist Jana Riess, How Millennials are Changing the LDS Church. She did a big survey in here. In the survey, there was a chapter on those that have left the church and the reasons why they left. There’s 30 different things listed here. The number two reason was, “I stopped believing there was one true church.” Actually, for Gen Xers, it was number one. I thought it would be good to have a video talking about this.

I will definitely say it’s fascinating to think about how small the church is. I have a strong testimony of the reality and truthfulness of the Church, but it is very small, 16.3 million members in a world of 7.7 billion people. How does that work? It’s a great question. Think about Israel back in the early days at the height of Israel with King David. It was still a fraction of the world population at that time. Think about the small band of Christians when Christ was here and set up His church.

I even took it a step further and thought about what about all of the Christians that have lived on the earth, everybody that’s existed throughout time? What percentage of the world’s population would that be? I estimated it would probably be around 10% at the very most because it’s very hard to calculate this, but I can say it’s certainly not above 20%. But you could say there’s probably over a hundred billion people that have lived on this earth that never even knew of Jesus Christ. How does this all work with God’s plan? I’m going to talk about that.

Matthew 7:14 says, “There’ll be few that find the path.” 1st Nephi 14 verse 12, Nephi’s vision of the latter days of the Church. He said, “The numbers were few, but they were upon all the face of the earth, but the dominion was small because of the numbers were few.” But it says in verse 14, “They’ll be armed with righteousness and power of God in great glory.”

A daunting task as it was to the early Christians that we are to go out and teach all nations there and to be the salt of the earth. If you think about that analogy, little pinch of salt will flavor the entire dish. Also, the leaven, the yeast, which makes the whole loaf rise there in Luke 13. I want to talk about our relationship with other Christians first and then talk very importantly about the world and the history of the world. But first about the Christians.

Actually, first, I want to share one of my favorite quotes from Joseph Smith. “While one portion of the human race is judging and condemning the other without mercy, the Great Parent of the universe looks upon the whole of the human family with a fatherly care and paternal regard.” Now, if you look here, this is straight from the Church, the Church Newsroom, under the topic Authority in the Church. “The fact that the original Church of Jesus Christ would eventually fall into a state of apostasy was foretold by ancient prophets and by the apostles in Christ’s day. Although Latter-day Saints believe that divine authority was lost in the ancient church after the death of the apostles and required a restoration by divine intervention, they do not dismiss or diminish the validity of other people’s religious experiences.”

“Much of the true doctrine taught by Jesus Christ is found in churches today. Members of other churches who accept Jesus Christ and try to live by the principles he taught are entitled to divine guidance and inspiration in their lives. Faithful Christians who are not Latter-day Saints still go to heaven, and those who live according to all the truth and light that they have will open themselves to further light in the hereafter. Anyone who accepts Jesus Christ as the son of God and the Redeemer of the world is a Christian, regardless of differences in theology. The Bible is a revelation from God of immense value for the powerful impact it has to change the lives of men and women. It is not diminished by the existence of additional scripture.”

Finally, I love this. “Informed Latter-day Saints do not argue that historic Christianity lost all truth or became completely corrupt. The orthodox churches may have lost the fullness of the gospel, but they did not lose all of it, nor even most of it. Many Evangelicals caricature or overstate the actual LDS view, which is that the orthodox churches are incomplete rather than corrupt. It is their post-biblical creeds that are identified in Joseph Smith’s first vision as an abomination, but certainly not their individual members or their members’ biblical beliefs.”

Robert Millet, who was the dean of the BYU Religious Department, put together a great piece called the Only True and Living Church. I’ll link to it in the notes. In it, he talked about several different things. One of these is about the creeds that were spoken of in the First Vision. These were post-New Testament creeds that sought to really redefine who God was and the nature of God. These also became political in nature. They became exclusionary tools, a way to define who a true Christian is. He talks about that. I’ll put it on the screen here. You can freeze it and read the long description here. But then also the professors mentioned in the First Vision there seem to be the antagonistic ministers in Joseph Smith’s immediate neighborhood.

In fact, Elder William Bangerter down at BYU Devotional said, “Do we believe that all ministers of other churches are corrupt? Of course not. Joseph Smith certainly did not intend that.”

Now, the other thing that Robert Millet does is he talks about what only one true church means, what it does not mean, and what it does mean. I’m just going to put it on the screen here. You can look at it, freeze the frame if you want. These overlap with some of the stuff I just read straight from the Church Newsroom department here, but seven things of what this does not mean, the only true church.

Now, here what only true church does mean. Number one, “The word only,” Neal A. Maxwell wrote, “Asserts a uniqueness and singularity about the Church as the exclusive ecclesiastical authority-bearing agent for our Father in heaven in this dispensation.” This is critical when it comes to the ordinances that pertain towards salvation and exaltation, that authority. If you look here, he defines the word true and then he says, “Thus, to refer to the restored Church as the only true church is to speak of it as being the most steady, sure, and solid institution on earth, the closest to the pattern of the primitive Christian Church.”

I share this quote here from Bishop Caussé. If you remember, when he was involved with the Paris, France temple, and the mayor of the city where it was going wanted to study the church before they authorized the approval of building the temple there. After this study, Bishop Caussé met with them. He describes this meeting. He says, “‘So what are your conclusions?’ I asked feeling a bit of anxiety. She replied, ‘We discovered that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is the closest to Jesus Christ’s original church than any other church we know of.'”

I think that’s powerful there and it’s not just partially true, as listed here. “Not, therefore, conceptually compromised by having been made up from doctrinal debris leftover from another age, nor is it comprised of mere fragments of the true faith.” Also, it’s living. “It’s alive, aware and functioning. It’s not a museum that houses a fossilized faith.” Number two, “The only true living church means that doctrinal finality rests with apostles and prophets, not theologians or scholars.” In fact, part of the Reformers was the idea of sola scriptura or the scriptures alone. Which if you think about it, it says here that everyone brings their own set of cultural biases and personal agendas and it becomes somewhat of a theological free-for-all without some authority being involved. Everyone becomes their own theologian. We believe the spirit needs to be involved, but there needs to be prophets to really… The final prophetic interpretation rests with the prophets.

Also, Christ told Peter that the gates of hell will not prevail against the Church. But this was talking about revelation. The process of revelation would be key. “It was as though Christ was saying, ‘Peter, you have gained the witness of who I am by revelation from God and is by revelation that I will build my church. As long as my people live in such a manner as to enjoy that spirit of revelation, individually and institutionally, the power and dominion of the devil will never be allowed to prevail over my kingdom.'”

Lastly, number three, he says “It means that while God will bless and strengthen and lead any person who follows the divine light within, each man or woman is responsible to be true to that light which leads unto all truth, to seek, search, weigh, and prove all things.” C. S. Lewis quotes here his mentor, “The highest good that men and women can do is to seek tenaciously for the greatest amount of light and knowledge that God will bestow.” Then, “Latter-day Saint doctrine affirms that all men and women will receive all the light, knowledge, divine attributes, powers, and heavenly rewards they desire to receive.” Keywords: desire and receive. “Either in this life or the next.

Remember part of our mortality, and in a sense, our second estate, let’s say, is the spirit world. God wants to give us everything that we will receive. If you look at D&C 76, it talks about the key is what we’re willing to receive. D&C 137 verse 9 talks about we’ll be judged by our works and by the desires of our heart. We just heard a passion plea in the April 2019 conference from President Nelson about seeking that desire and receiving it, not procrastinating. We’re responsible for the light and the promptings that we have received.

I think it’s much harder in the spirit world for those that have maybe received a great degree of light. I will talk here in a minute about many of the the hundred billion people that maybe did not receive anything and the spirit world is the key for them.

Okay. Speaking of these hundred billion people, I love this piece from fairmormon.org about when you think about how, again, they did not have even Christ in their life. How does this work in the end with God’s plan? If you look here, fairmormon.org did a piece here. “Many of the goals of the Plan of Salvation are achieved even without being a member of the Church. Among the most important purposes of life according to the Plan of Salvation are the following: receiving a physical body; experiencing trials, pain and other challenges, and having the opportunity to try to overcome them; experiencing joy and happiness; developing Christ-like attributes.”

“Developing Christ-like attributes is vital to our eternal happiness and development and living a mortal life accelerates us along that path. All these experiences are perfectly and regularly attainable without being a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. In fact, they are perfectly attainable without even being a Christian. For some, they are even attainable without believing in God.”

“That being said, there are tangible and extremely advantageous benefits to being a member of the Church, and more specifically, of knowing and understanding why we are here. Those advantages, though, are not necessary for a successful experience in mortality. The saving ordinances and covenants we make through proper priesthood authority accelerate and magnify our purposes for being here, and eventually, they will be available to all people whether in mortality or post-mortality. In the meantime, billions of people are here living the Plan of Salvation with a bit of ignorance about it, but happily and successfully nonetheless.”

I think of two scriptures that come to mind. Isaiah 55 verse 9 where God tells us His ways are higher than our ways and His thoughts and our thoughts. There’s something to how this is working that in my mind, it’s not the way I would do it, but I’m not in charge. His ways are higher than my ways. I think of Jacob 5, the allegory of Zenos, and where He says about the vineyard. He says, “Counsel me not,” about what He’s doing. Even about poor spots of ground. He says He’s nurturing them and He knows what He’s doing on there.

Let’s talk about how God speaks to His children. Joseph Smith said, “This is the principle on which the government of heaven is conducted, by revelation adapted to the circumstances in which the children of the kingdom are placed.” D&C 1 verse 24, “Behold, I am God and have spoken it. These commandments are of me and were given unto my servants in their weakness, after the manner of their language that they might come to understanding.”

There was a great presentation given in the 2017 FairMormon conference by Michael Ash called After the Manner of Their Language: The Key to Wisdom. Put this on the screen, you can read through this, but I’m just going to give you two little quick highlights. He says, “You as a parent, know how to modify your communication according to your child’s cognitive limitations. God does the same thing.” Then quoting that D&C 1:24, he says, “I believe that language refers to a much broader composition and includes not only spoken and written words but context influenced by cultural, education, era, as well as cognitive, visual, and auditory disabilities or vulnerabilities including bias, assumptions, and preconceived notions.”

He went on to talk about the three Rs. That as God communicates with people over time, that they have to recognize it and they have bias towards that and their culture. They have to recontextualize it in how they understand it, and even recording it then going through all those filters are affected by culture and bias.

Now, let’s talk about who God communicates. This is straight from the First Presidency. In 1978, they said, “The great religious leaders of the world such as Muhammad, Confucius, and the Reformers, as well as philosophers including Socrates, Plato, and others, received a portion of God’s light. Moral truths were given to them by God to enlighten whole nations and to bring a higher level of understanding to individuals.”

B. H. Roberts, he said, “God raises up wise men and prophets here and there among the children of men, of their own tongue and nationality, speaking to them through means they can comprehend. Wherever God finds a soul sufficiently enlightened and pure, one with whom His spirit can communicate, lo, He makes of him a teacher of men.”

Did this happen in the dark ages as an example? We call them dark for a reason. Right? Well, here’s President John Taylor. “There were men in those dark ages who could commune with God, and who by the power of faith, could draw aside the curtain of eternity and gaze upon the face of God, have the ministering of angels, and unfold the future destinies of the world. If those were dark ages, I pray God to give me a little darkness.”.

Then lastly, Ezra Taft Benson, April 1972 General Conference, “God, the Father of us all, uses the men of the earth, especially good men, to accomplish His purposes. It has been true in the past. It is true today. It will be true in the future.” Elder Benson then quoted the following from a conference address delivered by Elder Orson F. Whitney in 1928. “Perhaps the Lord needs such men on the outside of His church to help it along. They are among its auxiliaries, and can do more good for the cause where the Lord has placed them than anywhere else.”

Now, note this particularly poignant message. “God is using more than one people for the accomplishment of His great marvelous work. The Latter-day Saints cannot do it all. It is too vast, too arduous for any one people.” Elder Whitney then pointed out that we have no warfare with other churches. “They are our partners in a certain sense.”

It made me think of what just happened in Rome. If you look at the picture here, President Nelson meeting with Pope Francis. President Nelson said after this meeting that they had, he says, “‘The differences in doctrine are real and they’re important.’ President Nelson said afterward as he stood just outside St. Peter’s Square, ‘But they are not nearly as important as the things we have in common. Our concern for human suffering, the importance of religious liberty for all society, and the importance of building bridges of friendship instead of building walls of segregation.’ The two world religious leaders shared a belief that faith in God brings morality and stability to society.”

Okay. Now, how about the writings to His children through His servants? 2 Nephi 29:11-12, I want to share this and help us all think about this maybe in a way we don’t normally. Verse 11, “For I commanded all men, both in the east and in the west, and in the north and in the south, and in the islands of the sea, that they shall write the words which I speak unto them. For out of the books which shall be written, I will judge the world, every man according to their works, according to that which is written.”

Verse 12, “For behold, I speak unto the Jews and they shall write it. I shall speak unto the Nephites, they shall write it. I shall speak unto the other tribes of the house of Israel, which I have led away, and they shall write it.” Now, notice this. “I shall speak unto all nations, everyone of the earth, and they shall write it.”.

Very interesting. Where are these writings? That’s what they’ll be judged by. Let’s talk about that. I want to recommend two actually fantastic books here. Religions of the World. This is a fantastic one. A Latter-day Saint view, and he does a fantastic correlation with Latter-day Saint corollaries in various religions. He has a great chapter here of religious similarities at the end. He talks about the five different theories or ways this could have happened. Maybe diffusion is one key way, he says, back to an original source, back to Adam, days of Adam or divine inspiration. Those are the top two ideas. But anyway, there’s a chapter on all the major world religions.

The next quote I’m going share is from this book, Light & Truth: A Latter-day Saint Guide to World Religions. I highly recommend this book from Roger Keller. But I’m going to share this here with you. “God will speak to all nations of the world and they shall write.” The scripture we just read. “These books have to be the Quran of the Muslims, the Bhagavad Gita of the Hindus, the Analects of Confucius, the Tripitaka of the Buddhist, and the many other religious writings found among the great religions of the world.”

“This means that God has also given these books to his children and that they are holy scripture for them. They are as sacred to them as any holy writ that we have for us. In them, God addresses members of His family. He ignores none of his children. He gives them all guidance against which they will be judged, for God is a just God. Thus, Muslims are judged against the Quran, the Christians against the Bible, the Buddhist against the Tripitaka, the Hindus against the Bhagavad Gita, and the Latter-day Saint Christian against the four canonical volumes which God has given them. God holds no one accountable for what he has not given them, but each of us is responsible to live by what God has personally given to us.”

He carries on. He says, “Given the above, one can imagine a scene in which Heavenly Father called before Him a choice spirit and commissioned him to bring more light and truth to South Asia knowing that he would never hear the gospel. Would he do that? Of course, the only request being that someone later perform the saving ordinances for him in a temple. His name on earth was Siddhartha Gautama, the Buddha. Likewise, another choice spirit was asked if he would do something similar for those in Southwest Asia. Again, came the positive response with its request for someone to eventually perform his temple work. His earth name was Muhammad.”

“Now, imagine today as Buddhists and Muslims pass through the veil. Each is greeted by the Buddha or Muhammad with the words, ‘Welcome. Now, let me tell you the rest of the story.’ Is this not what D&C 138 is about: missionary work to the dead who have never heard the fullness of the gospel in this life and who need its saving ordinances so that they may have all that their Heavenly Father wishes for them?”

Remember, Christ went to the spirits in prison after He died. D&C 138 helps us understand Joseph Smith’s vision of the redemption of the dead. These big missionary forces were set up. There was this dramatic dream that Wilford Woodruff recorded in his journal where he saw Joseph… I’m going to put the full quote on here, but the key thing was everyone was frantically hurrying around. He finally was able to ask, “Joseph, why is everyone in a hurry?” This is the part I love about what Joseph said. “Each dispensation has had ample time to do this work. We have not. We are the last dispensation and so much work has to be done. We need to be in a hurry in order to accomplish it.”

Now, last couple of quotes. Church Newsroom – Treasuring All Truth. “Of course, our world is full of diverse individuals. Truth claims do and will continue to diverge, but they need not violently clash. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints’ founder Joseph Smith aspired to a better way. ‘If I esteem mankind to be in error, shall I bear them down? No. I will lift them up, and in his own way, if I cannot persuade him my way is better.'”

President Hugh B. Brown. “Even with the Church’s many important and unique truths, there is an incomprehensibly greater part of truth which we must yet discover. Our revealed truth should leave us stricken with the knowledge of how little we really know. It should never lead to an emotional arrogance based upon a false assumption that we somehow have all the answers that we in fact have a corner on truth. For we do not.”

Then last, and then I’m going to talk for a second about something called holy envy. The Church Newsroom – Treasuring All Truth. This is straight from the Church website. “Because truth is scattered among all nations and peoples, we believe in learning out of the best books of things that have been, things which are, things which must shortly come to pass, things which are at home, things which are abroad, the wars and perplexities of the nations, and a knowledge also of countries and of kingdoms.” This is a verse out of Doctrine and Covenants.

“Such knowledge helps Latter-day Saints be not only better citizens and neighbors, but also better saints. An expansive vision of truth can bring more depth, clarity, and love into our lives and make us more willing to listen, more able to understand, and more inclined to build up rather than tear down.”

I want to finish by sharing something from the late Krister Stendahl who was an Emeritus Lutheran Bishop of Stockholm, Sweden in the mid-80s. He actually taught at the Harvard Divinity School as well. He was a professor there, but he shared something. He fought for the Church actually. There was a lot of controversy about the building of this temple in Sweden. He fought actually for the Church. He talked about interfaith dialogue and interfaith understanding. He has three rules for it.

Number one is to always seek to understand from faithful members of that religious organization, not from their detractors. Number two, don’t compare your best to their worst. Number three, make room for holy envy, he called it. In fact, his holy envy for us was baptisms for the dead. He talked about how amazing that doctrine was. It’s a beautiful idea to try and find something that’s impressive or admirable in the traditions of various religious organizations. It doesn’t make one feel disloyal to their own faith.

I’d like to just share just briefly some of the holy envy I have for some of the major world religions. You think of Islam. The Muslims have the call to prayer five times a day. I think that’s beautiful. The Buddhist, if you think about, they have mastered the ability to ponder through meditation, especially in our world today. It’s very hard to ponder with all the distractions. I love the Hindus how they say, “Namaste.” That’s the divine in me recognizes the divine in you. I think that’s beautiful especially as Latter-day Saints, what we understand about that. I love the Christians with the… If you think of the Catholics and the Orthodox with their beautiful cathedrals, their love for that architecture, for ritual, the symbolism in so much of their practice. I love symbolism so I love that aspect.

The Protestants. I love their focus on grace. As members of the Church, we get so caught up in the works. We are judged by our works, we’re told, but the works don’t save us. At the end of the day, it’s the grace of Christ that does save us. I love that focus that the Protestants remind us of there.

I hope you enjoyed the video and subscribe for more content to come. Thanks.

Resources:

Books:

Light & Truth: A Latter-day Saint Guide to World Religions by Roger R. Keller

Religions of the World: A Latter-Day Saint View by Roger R. Keller and Spencer J. Palmer

Websites:

https://www.mormonnewsroom.org/articl…

https://rsc.byu.edu/archived/selected…

https://www.fairmormon.org/conference…

https://www.fairmormon.org/answers/Qu…

August 28, 2019 By Jeff Roundy Leave a Comment

Word of Wisdom Phase-in

This video discusses how and why the Word of Wisdom revelation was ‘phased-in’ over a 100 year period. Critics use this to try and shock members through ‘presentism’ – judging the past by the standards of today. In a recent study, a surprising number of active young church members seem to be living this principle in a more casual way – possibly using this history as justification? The video concludes with why trying to live this principle may be even more important than some realize. This video was not produced by or meant to be an official representation of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (known often in the past as the Mormon Church or LDS Church).

Okay, so in this video I want to talk about the Word of Wisdom and some issues that are surrounding the Word of Wisdom today that critics use. And specifically, I wanted to even mention at the beginning this study that was just done in the Jana Riess’ new book, The Next Mormons, on millennials.

One of the things that she said was the most stunning in her research in the survey was for millennials, that those that consider themselves very active had consumed coffee in the last six months there.

And I thought, “I wonder how they’re justifying that.” Maybe some of it is they study the Joseph Smith Paper projects, a lot of the Church history, going into a lot of depth. Maybe as they’re studying these things, or as critics are pointing out a lot of the things, how the Word of Wisdom was phased in, maybe they feel it’s justified.

Also critics try and shock people with some of this that they may not realize the phase-in of the Word of Wisdom over time and they hope people will use a thing called presentism, where you judge the past with today’s standards, which we certainly shouldn’t do with the Word of Wisdom.

The Church has done a great job with putting revelations in context. It’s actually on the Church website, that’s what it’s called, “Revelations in Context,” and if you look on Doctrine and Covenants 89, here’s a snippet from that.

“It required time to wind down practices that were so deeply ingrained in family tradition and culture, especially when fermented beverages of all kinds were frequently used for medicinal purposes. The term “strong drink” certainly included distilled spirits such as whiskey, which thereafter, the Latter-day Saints generally shunned. They took a more moderate approach to milder alcoholic beverages like beer and pure wine of the grape of the vine of your own make.”

“For the next two generations, Latter-day Saint leaders taught that the Word of Wisdom is a command from God, but they tolerated a variety of viewpoints on how strictly the commandment should be observed. This incubation period gave the Saints time to develop their own tradition of abstinence from habit-forming substances. By the early 20th century when scientific medicines were more widely available and temple attendance had become a more regular feature of Latter-day Saint worship, the Church was ready to accept a more exacting standard of observance that would eliminate problems like alcoholism from among the obedient. In 1921, the Lord inspired President Heber J. Grant to call on all Saints to live the Word of Wisdom to the letter by completely abstaining from all alcohol, coffee, tea, and tobacco. Today, Church members are expected to live this higher standard.”

So a little bit on the history there. We often consider the start of the Word of Wisdom with Emma complaining about cleaning up the floor in their Newel K. Whitney store room where the School of Prophets met, which was like a little MTC. In fact, recent analysis of this speech that Brigham Young gave actually was related to… It’s called Pitman shorthand, where they found that what Emma actually saying was that she couldn’t get the stains out of the floor. So not necessarily a complainer, but more of a strong cleaner, and was focused on the cleanliness of the room.

But the broader context, the social context of the Word of Wisdom came about, the temperance movement had started from after the Revolutionary War, for the 40 years up to 1830, alcohol consumption, specifically liquor, distilled spirits, had tripled, almost tripled in the United States to 1830, so it was a huge issue. A tremendous focus came about, and this temperance movement started in 1826 in Boston, the American Temperance Society.

Within five years there were 5,000 temperance societies around the country. By the mid 1830s, 1 out of 12 people in the United States was a member of a temperance society. So this was the environment that was happening. And if you think about it, this shouldn’t be an issue or concern. This is I’m sure a big part of what drove Joseph to his knees, trying to seek revelation of what to do in the midst of of this type of environment that they were in.

An interesting aspect of the temperance movement was actually coffee was focused on as a replacement for alcohol. In fact, temperance reformers were able to get Congress to remove the import duty on coffee and made it as cheap as whiskey to the people at the time. By 1833 every family virtually in the country, rich or poor, were drinking coffee on a daily consumption.

A few reformers did focus on stimulants of any kind or on hot drinks because of the focus on the body’s fluids and equilibrium, but the vast majority focused on using coffee as a replacement. Also the temperance reformers focused on fear tactics, linking alcohol with horrific diseases or social ills. If you look at the Word of Wisdom, it really just says these things are not good for man. There’s no explanation why, and instead actually there’s promises given for following these things.

Again an Evidences video on the Word of Wisdom that I just released with this as well. It’s just a great video to watch on this topic. So hot drinks, they were considered at the time, some viewed them maybe just as hot drinks, but the main idea of what that understanding was coffee and tea, by the reformers as well as Latter-day Saints, but there still was maybe some confusion here.

If you take a look at this on the screen, clarifying hot drinks, here’s Hyrum Smith, and he says here, “Again, ‘Hot drinks are not for the body, or belly.’ There are many who wonder what this can mean, whether it refers to tea or coffee, or not. I say it does refer to tea and coffee.”

And Joel Johnson, who was a member of the first School of Prophets when the revelation was received, he says, “When both Hyrum and Joseph were on the stand, the Prophet said to the Saints: ‘I understand that some of the people are excusing themselves in using tea and coffee because the Lord only said ‘hot drinks’ in the revelation on the Word of Wisdom. The Lord was showing us what was good for man to eat and drink. Now what do we drink when we take our meals? Tea and coffee. Is it not? Yes, tea and coffee. Then, they are what the Lord meant when he said ‘hot drinks.'”

And Brigham Young said, “I have heard it argued that tea and coffee are not mentioned in the Word of Wisdom; that is very true; but what were the people in the habit of taking as hot drinks when the revelation was given? Tea and coffee. We were not in the habit of drinking water very hot, but tea and coffee- the beverages in common use.”

The Church Handbook today, “The only official reputation of “hot drinks” in the Word of Wisdom is the statement made by early Church leaders that the term ‘hot drinks’ means tea and coffee.”

Okay, now. The comment about strong drink was really interpreted at the time as liquor, whiskey, hard liquor, distilled spirits. That was the big issue with the temperance movement. They thought of mild drinks, really. In fact, it even talks about barley in drinks, which would be considered beer, but they thought of beer, lightly fermented wine, or cider to be part of these mild drinks.

And that was the interpretation of the time. And it was often thought of as again, not a binding commandment necessarily on them but a principle, a divine recommendation. But again, not held to the standard it is today. There were lots of problems with water. Alcohol was sometimes used to help with that, as well as medicine practices that were sometimes used as well there. And then tobacco was used also for toothaches, other medical practices.

The real problems where you have to count with tobacco, watch the Evidences video for some stunning things about the evil designing, conspiring men of the last days that were predicted, and some recent big tobacco settlements that show perfect evidence of that.

So some examples of this presentism that critics will use. Some of the best examples I can share. One is from Carthage Jail. They drank some wine in the Carthage Jail and remember, they even viewed wine sometimes as a medicine for a stimulant, to restore both mood and energy, rather than recreational use per se.

John Taylor wrote, “Sometime after dinner we sent for some wine. It has been reported by some that this was taken as a sacrament. It was no such thing. Our spirits were generally dull and heavy and it was sent to revive us. All of us felt unusually dull and languid with remarkable depression of spirits.”

Another example would be even whiskey itself used in a very, say temperate way while traveling to restore fatigue may have been allowed. Here was Joseph investigating. Here’s what Joseph said, “The company moved on to Andover where the sheriff of Lee County requested lodgings for the night for all the company. I was put up into a room and locked up with Captain Grover. It was reported to me that some of the brethren had been drinking whiskey that day in violation of the Word of Wisdom. I called the brethren in and and investigated the case. And was satisfied that no evil had been done and gave them a couple of dollars with directions to replenish the bottle to stimulate them in the fatigues of their sleepless journey.”

So again, kind of interesting, and not to judge it upon our day today, Brigham Young, in the 1850s told the brethren if they’re going to chew tobacco in the Tabernacle to bring a spittoon and hit the mark because it was making the floor dirty and the women were getting their dresses dirty from the tobacco spit.

1861, Brigham Young sent families down to Southern Utah into Utah’s Dixie land. Part of the job was to create crops. They wanted to also grow grapes for wine that was to be used in the sacrament. By the 1870s there were 3000 gallons a year being produced down there. By the turn of the century, they were ripped out from Church authorities’ requests. Also, they were spending the money on tobacco and they’re paying out to foreigners to the east. And Brigham said, “If we’re going to be spending this money,” it was 60 to $80,000 in 1861 dollars which would be couple of million today. He said, “Let’s grow it ourselves and keep the money in our local economy at faster economic growth and self-sufficiency.”

So that was part of the focus there. And then the last one, I would give an example here, Wilford Woodruff in General Conference in 1880 he talked about going to Brigham City, and they were following the United Order there and everyone was following the Word of Wisdom closely and he was drinking coffee and he says, “The idea of drinking coffee where nobody else was drinking it was a very poor example, I thought for an apostle.”

So even the leaders at a time, they needed for adjustment.

“I therefore took instead of coffee, water and milk and felt a great deal better. The promise is that those who keep the Word of Wisdom shall run and not be weary, shall walk and not faint, and I can say I have enjoyed much better health than before.”

So some interesting examples of this presentism. Now let’s talk about the timeline. I’m going to share with you this timeline, I think would be helpful. 1826 was the American Temperance Society. Now I will share a great piece for this time. Let me just mention this. This is a piece in “Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought,” I’ll link this thesis from autumn 1981 “The Word of Wisdom: From Principle to Requirement,” and Thomas Alexander does some fantastic research on the timeline here, but 1826 American Temperance Society begins in Boston. 1833, Word of Wisdom revelation is received by Joseph Smith. 1861, President Brigham Young says, “Some of the brethren are very strenuous upon the Word of Wisdom and would like to have me preach upon it and urge it upon the brethren and make it a test of fellowship. I do not think I shall do so. I have never done so.”

1867, Elder Ezra T. Benson, “Supposing he had given the Word of Wisdom as a command, how many of us would have been here? I do not know; but he gave this without a command or constraint observing that it would be pleasing in His sight for His people to obey His precepts. Ought we not to try to please our Heavenly Father?”

1898, President Woodruff said, “He regarded the Word of Wisdom in its entirety, as given of the Lord for the Latter-day Saints to observe, but he did not think that bishops should withhold recommends from persons who did not adhere strictly to it.” That was in the First Presidency minutes.

1902, President Joseph F. Smith urged stake presidents and others to refuse recommends to flagrant violators, but to be somewhat liberal with old men who used tobacco and old ladies who drank tea. Habitual drunkards, however, were to be denied temple recommends.

1906, the First Presidency and Council of the Twelve began using water instead of wine for their sacrament meetings. And there are some interesting things I’ll link in the notes of the early Christians that did some of this too. And Joseph talked about… If you recall in 1830, when he was going to get wine, it was warned by an angel of some poisoning efforts and that it didn’t matter what they took as long as they did it for the right reasons and the right purpose of taking the sacrament there.

So again, back to this here, 1907 strong prohibition movement begins to develop in the U.S. 1912, rest of the Church follow leaders and eliminate wine use in sacrament meetings, went up until 1922 in some places. 1915, President Joseph F. Smith instructed, “Brethren were not to receive priesthood or temple attendance without adherence to the Word of Wisdom.” 1918, Heber J. Grant becomes the Prophet. 1920, federal prohibition begins in the U.S., and then 1921, President Heber J. Grant says all temple recommends to require adherence to the Word of Wisdom, but it was technically added to the General Handbook of Instructions in 1933. This was the 100th year anniversary of the revelation of the Word of Wisdom. That’s really the the incubation period the Lord allowed.

Federal prohibition ends that same year. Interesting. And in 1972, the First Presidency statement that Church has no opinion on Cola drinks, but advises avoiding habit-forming drinks. And then sometime in the 2000s, I couldn’t find the exact date, but added to the Handbook, “Members should not use any substance that contains illegal drugs. One should avoid harmful or habit-forming substances except under the care of a competent physician.”

Sometimes it’s questioned about why some things are emphasized in the Word of Wisdom for a temple recommend interview for example and not others. What’s considered obeying the Word of Wisdom in the Handbook of Instruction? I love this piece that was on Fairmormon.org. Let me share this, “With respect to the question of why we do some things (tend to eat lots of meat) but not others (don’t drink tea). The reason for that likely has much to do with the concept of following the counsel of living prophets. The current Church Handbook says “hot drinks” means tea and coffee, and it forbids the use of illegal drugs, even though neither tea nor illegal drugs are explicitly mentioned in the Word of Wisdom. Like other scriptures, we rely on guidance from living prophets to help us to know how Doctrine and Covenants Section 89 should be applied in our time. With respect to eating meat sparingly, that remains a word of wisdom, but, unlike refraining from tea, is not mentioned in the current handbook and has not been publicly mentioned by any General Authorities for many years.”

And then some recent updates. In 2012, the Church Newsroom Website posted this on the clarification of the piece in the Mormon in America broadcast on Rock Central TV Program. They said “Finally, another small correction: despite what we reported, the Church revelation spelling out health practices, (D&C 89) does not mention the use of caffeine. The Church’s health guidelines prohibit alcoholic drinks, smoking or chewing of tobacco, and hot drinks- taught by Church leaders to refer specifically to tea and coffee.”

So I will tell you in closing, a couple of key things. Sociologists… I shared this in the Polygamy Introduction video, they’ve actually found in growing religions two kind of key ingredients. One is it requires sacrifice, the religion does, and two, that there’s some modest tension with the host community that the people live in. Polygamy certainly did that, but if you look after polygamy was gone and also the gathering was not focused at coming to to Utah per se, but going out into the world. The Word of Wisdom was essentially a marker for the people, and certainly did what the sociologists talk about there.

And if you look in the past, God has has often required outward signs as a signal of His covenant people. Circumcision as an example, or Sabbath Day observance, or not eating pork. These were visible signs of acknowledgement of the covenant, sign of the covenant. And doing these things in Word of Wisdom, they’re not morally wrong. In fact, we’re told we’re going to drink wine with the Savior essentially in the millennium, fruit of the vine, but today and in consequence of what was to come, it essentially became a commandment for us, binding upon us after this hundred year phase-in process.

And in fact, Elder Packer talked about the promises at the end of the Word of Wisdom in a great talk. And I love how he talked about the last part of the Passover and the promise of avoiding this death. And he talked about a spiritual death that can come about from substances in the Word of Wisdom. So, fascinating thought.

So I love this conclusion I want to share with you from Fairmormon.org. I love the way they worded this. He says, on the website, this is how it’s worded, “It’s a common misconception among both members and nonmembers that the Word of Wisdom exists primarily or only to promote the health of the members. Health protection is an important ‘side benefit'” one might say, but arguably the most important reason for the Word of Wisdom is the promise given in the last verse of D&C 89, in which the members are told: ‘And I, the Lord, give unto to them a promise that the destroying angel shall pass by them, as the children of Israel, and not slay them.'”

“This refers to the last curse put on the Egyptians prior to the Exodus from Egypt. The Israelites were to mark their houses with lamb’s blood at the first Passover. Houses so marked were protected from the destroying angel.”

“Is lamb’s blood magic? Does it repel angels like garlic does vampires? Hardly. Rather, we understand the blood to be a symbol of the covenant between God and Israel, and Christians understood it to be a foreshadowing of the culmination of that covenant as the blood of Jesus Christ protects from sin and destruction those who enter into a covenant with Him.”

“Thus, the Word of Wisdom functions in a similar way- it marks us as people under covenant to God. Consumption of coffee and tea is a common practice in many cultures- when others notice a member of the Church abstaining, it sets them apart as willing to forgo something that is culturally popular. This reinforces our duty to keep our covenants in both our own minds and in the eyes of others.”

And then I love this conclusion, “Adherence to the Word of Wisdom is often a mark of a committed Latter-day Saint and is an outward sign of their separation from the world and their participation in the fellowship of God’s covenant people. Non-observance or observance of the Word of Wisdom often reflects one’s commitment (or lack thereof) to the covenants with God as well as a possible indicator as to how one might approach other commandments.”

I hope if you’re one of these millennials that I talked to you about at the very beginning of the video that this will provide some rational reasons and encouragement to maybe more fully embrace and live the Word of Wisdom in completeness.

Hope you enjoyed the video and check out the Evidences video on the Word of Wisdom. Fascinating studies that I share in that video. Thanks.

Resources:

Podcast:

LDS Perspectives interview with Jed Woodworth on the Word of Wisdom https://www.ldsperspectives.com/2017/…

Video:

Church History Dept video on the development and practice of the Word of Wisdom https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_OrvO…

Websites:

https://history.lds.org/content/revel…

http://www.dialoguejournal.com/wp-con…

https://scholarsarchive.byu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1004&context=byusq

https://www.fairmormon.org/answers/Wo…

https://www.sltrib.com/religion/2018/…

August 28, 2019 By Jeff Roundy Leave a Comment

Messiah Ben Joseph – Evidences

This video discusses the ancient Hebrew tradition of Messiah Ben Joseph, a prophet (descended from Joseph of Egypt) that was to be a latter-day restorer and forerunner before the Messiah (known as Messiah Ben David) would come in His glory. The correlations between the traditions of Messiah Ben Joseph and the life of Joesph Smith are remarkable and another powerful evidence of the restoration.

On this Evidences video, I’m going to be talking about an ancient Hebrew tradition known as Messiah Ben Joseph. This was a second Messiah that was to come to lead the way for the true Messiah. Messiah Ben David, as they call it, the son of David, Jesus Christ in all His glory. There was to be a forerunner, a preparer, a restorer that was to come at the end of days. Fascinating.

We particularly have interest in this as Latter-Day Saints in understanding some of the origins of this. There is a lot of it that is shrouded in mystery. The original origins are by tradition that it came from Joseph of Egypt, and even Rachel, his mother, a part of this, but Joseph of Egypt prophecies about this, one of his descendants to be a restorer in the last days.

If you look in the Book of Mormon, 2 Nephi 4, Nephi talks about the prophecies of Joseph of Egypt, that there weren’t many greater than that, and that they were had in the brass plates.

If you look in the Bible, we don’t have this. We do have it in the Joseph Smith translation of Genesis 50. Verse 33 in particular refers to this, this latter-day restorer as somebody that will be named after Joseph and it will be after his father’s name there. We’re told that we actually have some of that prophecy in 2 Nephi 3, the Lehi shares there. It’s very powerful to think of the this Messiah Ben Joseph tradition in light of of that there, from the brass plates.

Also, I’m going to share with you many parallels with Joseph Smith’s life that come out of this.

Now, as I mentioned, the scholars and theologians have been unsuccessful in determining the origin of the tradition. “Without knowing where or from whom the tradition originated, one can only make a vain attempt to explain the ambiguities relating to the tradition. Coming to a full understanding of the tradition is difficult considering the fact that every rabbi and scholar have expressed different ideas or theories surrounding it.” There are quite a few nuggets that are fascinating I’ll share with it.

If you want to look back to the oldest writings that we have that have discussions of of Messiah Ben Joseph … I’m going to call him MBJ for quicker relation in the video here. There are four. If you look on the screen, the Talmud, which is a collection of rabbinical discussions that were recorded back to about 200 A.D., the Targumim, which was ancient translations of the Hebrew Bible. That goes back to the second temple period, 537 to to 20 B.C. The Kabbalistic writings, which are Jewish mystical traditions, and then the Apocryphal writings, which were extra-biblical texts resembling scripture. That was from 300 B.C. to 100 A.D. Several thousand years old, so very ancient, these traditions.

Now we can actually see some of this legend maybe come through in John, the gospel of John, John 1: 19 through 21, where the Jewish leaders are quizzing John the Baptist. It says, “And this is the record of John. When the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him, ‘Who art thou?’ And he confessed and denied not, but confessed, ‘I am not the Christ.’ And they asked him, ‘What then? Art thou Elias?'” In Greek, that’s Elijah. He was to come before the great and wrathful day of the Lord. “And he said, ‘I am not.’ ‘Art thou that prophet?'” Who are they talking about? He says and answered no. Interesting thought with Messiah Ben Joseph tradition.

Now there have been writings on this in the church from different scholars, but no one has gone as deep by a long shot to Trevan Hatch. He actually, I’m going to link this paper and use it in this video now, he presented this at a symposium at BYU in 2007. It’s now been published in the Religious Study Center at BYU. Extremely qualified. He looked at this tradition and said, nobody has gone really deep in a lot of the things that rabbis have said over the centuries on this and the parallels with Joseph Smith. He put together this paper, and it’s fascinating. What I’m going to do in this video now is I’m going to give you a bunch of nuggets from this paper and I’m just going to share some of the highlights. I’ve just underlined those. If you want to pause the screen, you can see the full text of some of the … Those were pulled out of his longer paper, but I may highlight just a few snippets from each of those.

Go on. First of all, Messiah Ben Joseph was to come to in what they called the Messianic Age. If you look on the screen here, People will know that the Messianic Age has arrived when they see an increase in miracles, works of evil, and great calamities. It could be upheavals in family life, worldwide warfare, increase in drunkenness and immorality. Youths will no longer respect their parents, the pious, and the aged.” It talked about Amos 8, where there’d be a famine in the land. It’s a famine of hearing the words of the Lord. They’ll seek the Lord, the word of the Lord, and shall not be able to find it. That will be the time when Messiah Ben Joseph will come, this Messianic Age.

Now, calamities around the birth of MBJ, such as earthquakes and plagues. Six years following Joseph’s birth, we had the seventh largest earthquake in US history in the Midwest in the New Madrid region. Five weeks later, a second earthquake of equal proportion. Two weeks later, the ninth largest earthquake in US history. Three years after that, we had one of the history’s largest volcanic eruptions. It exploded in Mt. Tambora in Indonesia, which had crop failures clear over here in 1815 and 1816, almost causing a famine. This is what actually led Joseph’s family to move to New York, if you recall that story early in the life of the prophet Joseph Smith.

Joseph’s birth itself was fascinating. It was on December 23rd of 1805, which was the day after the winter solstice in the northern hemisphere. Where Joseph lived, this was the greatest night of darkness in a sense, and where we start to look to the light was when Joseph was born, the day after the winter solstice. If you think about it, the darkness is at its depth for three days and so 22nd, 23rd, 24th Christmas Day, the light begins to then come about and days begin longer at that time. Fascinating.

If you think about, Joseph’s name itself means to add or to increase. That’s what it means in Hebrew. It’s fascinating to think of the symbolism possibly with that, even with Joseph’s mission of helping those on the other side of the veil. If you think about that time of Christ where He went to go to preach to the spirits in prison between His death and His resurrection. I love symbolism and I think there’s symbolism in everything around us. I wouldn’t be surprised if there’s some symbolism in there.

Messiah Ben Joseph, let’s look at this. “God will send His prophet and His anointed king.” In fact, that word king might be confusing here. I will share this. On April 11th, 1844, Nauvoo, Illinois, George Albert Smith recorded in his diary under the date of May 9th, 1844, that “Joseph Smith had been installed as king over the immediate House of Israel by the Council of 50. A revelation from the Lord to the Council of 50 on June 27th, 1882, verified that Joseph Smith had been called to be a prophet, seer, and revelator to my church and kingdom and to be a king and ruler of Israel.” Kind of an interesting insight. “Regarded as a prophet who will restore.” What would need to be restored? One thing is that Amos 8, being able to hear the word of God or even find it. MBJ “will restore belief in the supernatural and that angels and miracles will accompany the Messianic Age. He will also restore the understanding of the doctrine of repentance.” Fascinating.

Okay. Joseph Smith and the restoration. Moroni quoted Isaiah 11 and said it was about to be fulfilled. Isaiah 11 refers directly to the Messianic Age and the gathering of Israel. In the teachings from the ancient prophets and rabbis, a trumpet was used to symbolize the preaching of the Gospel, the gathering of Israel, and the coming of the Messiah. We think about our temples, the statue of the angel Moroni with the trumpet pressed to his lips. This is fascinating. This rabbi here, mid third century A.D. talked about “precious stones will be used during the Messianic Age. It was Joseph Smith who used precious stones to translate the gold plates.”

What was the significance of when Joseph got the plates? September 22nd, 1827, This day happened to be one of the Jewish High Holy Days, Rosh Hashanah, also known as the Feast of the Trumpets. On this Jewish holiday, the trumpet, ram’s horn, or Shofar, is sounded in celebration of the future gathering of Israel, the rebuilding of the temple, and the coming of the Messiah Ben David.”

Okay, gathering of Israel. Messiah Ben Joseph and the gathering of Israel. “Preaching the Gospel is directly related to the gathering of Israel. The rabbis taught that MBJ will work to gather the lost tribes.” In fact, they use the term ensign and gather, which is in D&C 113: 6. Those exact words are used by the Lord in talking about the work here, the ensign and the gathering.

Moses appeared. April 3rd, 1836, in the Kirtland Temple and “committed unto us the keys to the gathering of Israel”, Joseph said in D&C 110. In 1841, Joseph sent Orson Hyde to Jerusalem for the purpose of dedicating the land for the return of the Jews. “This he did fulfilling the prophecies of the prophets and teachings of the rabbis, that the MBJ would do a great work in gathering the lost tribes and restoring the Jews to the Holy Land.” The Jewish Encyclopedia states that MBJ “will not gather all the tribes during his lifetime, but will be instrumental in gathering part of the ten tribes. The gathering will continue throughout the Messianic Age.”

Okay, now return of Elijah. “Jews also taught that the return of Elijah would occur during the Messianic Age. According to one modern scholar, when Elijah returns, he will appear on the top of a mountain. This is intriguing for Latter-Day Saints as well as Jews who believe that the tops of the mountains, or mountain of the Lord’s house refers to the Lord’s Temple. Elijah appears to Joseph Smith on April 3rd, 1836, in the Kirtland Temple. This day, the 16th of Nisan, was the second day of the Passover season in the year 1836. Elijah returned during the Passover season and more specifically on the second day of Passover, a day some Jewish sects open their doors to Elijah and hold another Seder feast for a second consecutive day.”

Here’s my little commentary on this, is that this was Easter Sunday. He appeared the next day and it was Easter Sunday. Think about the great ushering in of the work on the spirit world that was made possible through the Resurrection. It would almost make sense that it would come on Easter Sunday, and it was a Sunday, Easter Sunday. It was still during Passover.

“When Elijah appeared in the Kirtland Temple, he bestowed upon Joseph Smith and Oliver Cowdery sealing powers that would unite families for eternity. Klausner states that Elijah will be a maker of peace among families. Interestingly, Moses and Elijah appeared to Joseph Smith and Oliver Cowdery on the same day in 1836. We find in rabbinical commentary of the second century BC a passage stating that Moses and Elijah would arrive together at the end of time or in the Messianic Age.”

A few other quick nuggets. MBJ is to rebuild the temple of Israel and restore its true worship. Also, MBJ is to be a warrior. Now, that might take us by surprise with Joseph. There’s some spiritual aspects I’ll mention next, but it is interesting to note that on March 10th, 1841, Thomas Carlin, governor of the State of Illinois, commissioned Joseph to the rank of Lieutenant General over the Nauvoo Legion, which is estimated to have been 5,000 man strong. It was not only the largest military unit in the state of Illinois, but it was second only in size to the U.S. army in the entire United States at the time. Kind of interesting.

Now, on a spiritual level though … This is the war with Gog and Magog and the death of MBJ. “The rabbis taught that during the lifetime of NBJ, a war will ensue with Gog and Magog. This war will not be a physical war as much as it will be a spiritual one, and it will be fought between the forces of good and evil. Now listen to this. Remarkably, on on the night that Joseph received the the plates, Rosh Hashanah, another fascinating event occurred. A group of people, including Heber C. Kimball, who was unknown to Joseph Smith at the time, saw a vision in the sky of two armies engaged in a great battle. Perhaps this vision was given as a sign in the forthcoming war to be fought between the forces of good and evil, a war in which MBJ would participate. MBJ was also to use a sword on the spiritual battleground to fight his enemies.” “The sword, which will be the chief weapon of the righteous army, will be that of prayer.” “It was the prayer of Joseph Smith that brought about the restoration. The rabbis expected the war to begin shortly following the return of Elijah.”

“Armilus means the son of Satan or the anti-Messiah. MBJ will die by the hand of Armilus shortly after being captured by him and taken as a prisoner.” Think of Joseph taken to Carthage Jail and three days later he was killed. “Following the death of MBJ, Armilus will drive the remnants of Israel into the wilderness. Enoch in vision saw this take place. He saw them riding in chariots traveling from the east. Klausner translates chariots as wagons.” “After the death of Joseph Smith in 1844, the Saints were indeed driven from their homes into the wilderness.”

Now in conclusion, “We must keep in mind that the rabbis were not prophets, at least not in the traditional sense, therefore these legends and traditions must be considered as just that, traditions.” I will say there’s even another tradition that I’ll link to here of how the Messiah Ben Joseph could have been Jesus Christ even. There is a write up of that about ten years ago in the Biblical Archaeology Review. It was published at the blog By Common Consent. I’ll link to that. There’s a lot of things that don’t fit with a lot of these things that we just talked about here. Take that for what it is. Again, it’s still controversial.

“However, the fact that scholars and rabbis had been teaching and believing in a Messiah Ben Joseph, one who will be born into the world to restore God’s kingdom and prepare the way for the Messiah is remarkable. Joseph Smith appeared to have fulfilled many of the Jewish expectations of MBJ. He claimed to be a prophet and a restorer, and he was visited by Elijah and Moses during his lifetime. He saw the Messiah in vision. His work raised fury in the land of Christendom, and he was killed in direct association with his divinely appointed mission.”

One quick story John Tvedtnes told. He said “In the late 1970s while teaching with the Brigham Young University Jerusalem program, I was invited to give a series of lectures in Hebrew on the subject of Mormonism at the University of Haifa. In one of the lectures, I displayed a chart outlining Joseph Smith’s major accomplishments. I intended to speak about each item on the list and at the end suggest that Joseph Smith fit the qualifications for the Messiah of Joseph expected by the Jews, but that turned out to be unnecessary. By the time I got through the top third of the list, I heard whispering among a group of Orthodox Jewish students in the audience. They were saying ‘Messiah Ben Joseph, Messiah, the son of Joseph.'” Fun story.

Lastly, I want to close with this quote from Joseph Fielding McConkie who wrote on this. He says, “Our prophet bears the right name, he was of the right lineage, he was in reality anointed, he did the right works, he taught the right doctrines, and he died the violent death anticipated by the traditions. All of this he did without ever hearing of the legends of which we speak, and in doing so, he stood singularly and uniquely alone among the religious leaders of the world. Not since the days of the Bible has there been one like him.”

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